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Song Editor and MPE support (Roli, Linnstrument, etc.)

Ke10gKe10g BerlinPosts: 22

Dear Jamie and fellow Downrushers,

I've been toying with MPE (MIDI polyphonic expression) control of the deluge. The Deluge is capable of MPE, it just is very tedious to implement. I'm wondering if you, or anyone else listening, might be able to help. I'm not much of a programmer and I feel it would be fairly straight forward to streamline the process with an XML editor. Given that there are very few hardware MPE synths out there, there is a great incentive to get this going. The basic idea for using the current Deluge as an MPE synth is that you use each track as a synth voice. So you basically have the same synth preset copied onto as many tracks as voices you want, and map each track to a different midi channel. It would be great to have an editor for this, as it is REALLY tedious to set up. Ideally, I think, it should be added as an extra feature of Downrush in the form of an enhanced song editor.

Here is my process for doing MPE with Deluge (I use a couple Roli Seabord Blocks as MPE controllers, so the CCs mentioned here correspond to those, but the process would be similar with different instruments):

-make a synth sound you like
-map aftertouch to some parameter
-copy the preset to as many tracks as voices you want
-on each track, learn the midi note channel for that voice (for 8 voices I use channels 2-9)
-on each track, learn the 'Y' (vertical slide) parameter (cc 74 for each channel, by default on seaboard)
--- the other "dimensions" of the 5D controller are "automatically" mapped: pitch bend and aftertouch and note-number-to-pitch.
--- you can then do global modifications of your synth patch for all voices by modulating the knobs on the song level.
------I use Max MSP to "learn" the midi in channels and the cc74 Y parameter to each of the tracks... in any case you need a device that allows you to send a single message precisely to the Deluge.

I've toyed with modifying the song XML directly to do this, but it is still a major pain.

I'm thinking of an interface similar to Douwnrush kit editor for Songs that allows you to:
-select an existing preset and apply it to different tracks
-assign midi in channel number to those tracks
-map aftertouch, velocity, and cc74 to the parameters to each of those tracks/synths
---One issue is that while aftertouch, pitch bend, and note number, is handled by Deluge at the "track" level, CCs are handled at the "sound" level, in the Deluge file format.

A more sophisticated MPE-oriented version of this might allow you to select the number of voices you want, choose a midi start channel, and select your "patch cable" connections (mappings), and the program would automatically create a Song with the appropriately configured tracks for use as an MPE synth.

What do you think?

Thanks for your time!

Post edited by Ke10g on


  • 1
    scottmoonscottmoon Grass Valley, CA USAPosts: 6

    I would love the Deluge to support MPE and my Linnstrument. Your solution looks too complicated for me. Maybe Synthrom will add it in a future update.

  • 0
    Ke10gKe10g BerlinPosts: 22

    That would be best. My solution currently is too complicated, definitely. The xml editor based on something like downrush would be a good work around, but ideally, this should be implemented in the deluge itself. Totally agree.

  • 1
    keymankeyman Palmela, PortugalPosts: 9

    I’m also very much into MPE; have a couple of controllers capable and in need for more MPE sound sources, sure I would love an implementation allowing Deluge to support MPE.

  • 1
    Ke10gKe10g BerlinPosts: 22

    Ok! Looks like mpe is coming in firmware 3.0!

  • 0
    EddyEddy ColognePosts: 179

    @Ke10g said:
    Ok! Looks like mpe is coming in firmware 3.0!

    where is that mentioned?

  • 0
    Ke10gKe10g BerlinPosts: 22

    @Eddy said:

    @Ke10g said:
    Ok! Looks like mpe is coming in firmware 3.0!

    where is that mentioned?

    Looks like I was wrong. They already added X and Y modulation points on the new panels, which I read somewhere is in provision of an eventual native MPE implementation, but it looks like that will be for a future update. :)

  • 4
    OdoSendaidokaiOdoSendaidokai BerlinPosts: 186

    Yes it seems to be one of the "coming soon" features

    X and Y (coming soon) - MIDI MPE support will be added in a future Deluge firmware update. These modulation sources refer to the horizontal and vertical sideways pressure which a user of an MPE-compatible MIDI controller may apply to each key with the finger pressing it.

    I hope when implementing MPE the MIDI implementation will be done together with
    1. a finally full implementation of Midi
    2. finalize the half implemented Midi 1.0 standard
    3. the rework of global and local Midi definition clutter
    4. the removal of the weird 50 step options in favor of 127 steps ... or
    5. maybe Midi 2.0 ?

  • 0
    Just_Peter118Just_Peter118 The NetherlandsPosts: 38

    Yes please, MPE support!

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